1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

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tgreese
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by tgreese »

Check slack (deflection) in the timing chain. I would routinely replace the timing set unless it's brand new.

Usual option for a damaged crank is to buy a "crank kit" which includes a reground crank and properly sized bearings. Exchange for your old crank.

Even if the ridge is minimal, you should still remove it before you remove the pistons. The only reason you remove it is so that the rings don't hang up and break when you remove or replace the pistons.

Unlikely that you have worn rings and no perceivable ridge, unless someone was in there before you and removed the ridge. The loss of compression should have been diagnosed before disassembly of the engine. Since the bores are in good condition and you have a loss of compression, I would suspect the exhaust valves.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 Chryco Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green
Blockchain the vote.

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GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

tgreese wrote:The loss of compression should have been diagnosed before disassembly of the engine. Since the bores are in good condition and you have a loss of compression, I would suspect the exhaust valves.
Good feedback. The compression issue was from the head gasket. After doing a compression test 2 neighboring cylinders were off.

Your advise has been very good, and appreciated. I'll take it again here and pull the springs this weekend to view the valves.

Can't wait to get to the rebuilding portion of this project. ImageImage

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

So far so good. Managed to pull the valves out, the big the C-clamp type tool looks the best tool, which I didn't have. If using the smaller tool, really make sure you're at the very bottom. Then when the spring is compressed, use a C-clamp on the valve and the top side of the spring to pop it and release the pressure fitting.

Anyway, ton of carbon as you can see. Watched a few videos on cleaning, none are working.... yet.Image

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

440sixpack
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by 440sixpack »

That from burning oil. your guides are probably shot.

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

440sixpack wrote:That from burning oil. your guides are probably shot.
Yeah, picking up a bore gauge and micrometer to do some measurements... not inexpensive.

Good news is the top of the block is flat. For anyone removing gaskets I'd recommend the CRC Gasket Remover. It'll remove paint too, so be careful with it but it definitely works. Skip plastic scrapers.

Pulled the crankshaft out, got the manuals, and continued some body work. Image

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

440sixpack
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by 440sixpack »

With the spring off put a valve in the guide and push sideways back and forth. if you get noticeable movement you don't need to measure you need new guides.


No more than it costs to have everything hot tanked, magged and measured I'd just do that. you're going to pay for it anyway before they machine everything so save the time .

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

More engine and body work ahead today, but made some progress elsewhere by fixing the seat.

In fixing the seat, I had to take off this spring. Any thoughts how to get it coiled back on?

After much research it appears to sometimes be called a hood spring, despite its location under the seat. The tab goes under that bar (the center of the spring should be rotated one more turn, then re-coiled back).

Also, if you suspect your motor is bad, you can just temporarily swap the seat motors to isolate the issue.


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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer
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tgreese
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by tgreese »

Power front seat? First thing I would do is check the parts book to see if it's a serviceable part. If it is, there may be a procedure in the TSM.

Usually it's helpful to think about how the factory put such stuff together. However, I expect they put it on the frame before the upholstery went on and they had a jig of some sort to tension the spring. You may be able to make a tool that turns the spring center before you slide it over the hub. Thin-nose vise grips to hold the center of the spring, and rotate by hand or with the help of some other pliers. Then slide the coiled-up spring into the slot and out of the pliers end.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 Chryco Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green
Blockchain the vote.

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

Okay, been a while but got my crankshaft done! Shop says, you need a size 10 main bearing and size 20 bearing for the connnecting rods. I'm trying to Google, but does size 10 refer to 0.010 Undersized and size 20 would be 0.020 Undersized?

On to the header, the valve stem guides are all good. The valve stems appear off by maybe 0.0005. The valves listed on Rock Auto either appear to be to long, or .0002 to small. Will have to continue the search.

Hopefully by end of month reassembly begins... Image

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

Been working on the interior and restoring the steering wheel. Was really pleased with the finish (bottom right), unfortunatley it will need a color redo. If anyone is thinking of this, sand paper starting at 400 or 600, then went to 1500. Leather cleaner / degreaser (or just soap and rubbing alcohal), let dry, paint on.

When it comes to the dash, the TSM says to remove the windshield. Anybody done this? Any quick tips?Image

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Last edited by GrandW on Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

candymancan
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by candymancan »

Just get a new wheel cover and stitch it on much easier then sanding removing the steering wheel and dying leather which will leach the dye no matter what you do . They sell matching colors, my 90 the cover was torn on the top from someone who drives with 1 hand on top.

Bought a new cordovan wheel skin from wheelskins.com and cut the old one off and stitched the new one one. Did the same for my moms 4.0 and my 5.9. Also got one for a friends car too..

Theyre like 35$



https://m.imgur.com/a/eUBfX


as for the dash pad ive removed one this year on a 89 GW... Its fairly flat not warped like mine. I just havent put it on yet. Put it on storage with mineral oil on it. To remove it you need to to pull the a.c controls. radio. the glove box. The instrument cluster.. Then prepair to bend your hands in awkward positions using i believe 7 8 10mm sockets... Yea all the nuts are various sizes.. I was cursing like a sailor.

The windshield i was told you have to remove as well so i did and like said all those 13mm bolts are under the windshield gasket. But due to the dash pad vinyl being hard over the years the pad wasnt even being held on by the bolts as the bolt tore right through the pad material lol.. So when i remove mine in my 90 i am going to take a razor blade and cut the dash padd off from under the gasket.. Just cut it off so you have an inch or so of the dash pad UNDER the gasket.. This way when you put a new dash pad on you can just tilt it up and slide it under the windhshield gasket and the gasket will hold it down.. like it was anyway.

Am i making sense here ? There really isnt a need to remove the windhshield if you do it like this.. Just cut under the gasket not along the gasket.

Buttr if youre one of those puritan anal people go ahead and remove the entire windhshield.. Im 99.9% certsin my way will work.. I mean once its bolted down and the windshiekd gasket is laying on top of it.. where exactly is it going to go ?
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 219k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 430k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 155k
1976 Jeep J10.. 85k(repaired)

letank
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:16 pm
Location: SF bay area

Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by letank »

GrandW wrote:Been working on the interior and restoring the steering wheel. Was really pleased with the finish (bottom right), unfortunalty it will need a color redo. If anyone is thinking of this, sand paper starting at 400 or 600, then went to 1500. Leather cleaner / degreaser (or just soap and rubbing alcohal), let dry, paint on.

Impressive detailled work. While I was crawling under the steering wheel, the stench of the sweaty wheel cover detracted me from the ongoing wiring fix... removed the slipped cover, and use paint thinner to clear the black stains, a quick dab of leather conditioner that has been laying around for the last 20 years in the garage and put on another JY slipped-on type ...

As said too much work for the windshield removal unless it is showing signs of leaks... if you have the windshield removed make sure that the correct sealant is used, not silicone, but proper windshield / Glass sealant is used otherwise the acid silicone will make the metal rust and ruins your A pillar ...
candymancan wrote:Just get a new wheel cover and stitch it on much easier then sanding removing the steering wheel and dying leather which will leach the dye no matter what you do . They sell matching colors, my 90 the cover was torn on the top from someone who drives with 1 hand on top.

Bought a new cordovan wheel skin from wheelskins.com and cut the old one off and stitched the new one one. Did the same for my moms 4.0 and my 5.9. Also got one for a friends car too..

Theyre like 35$
Groovy, the way to do it
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)
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1971J4000
Posts: 192
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by 1971J4000 »

will e wrote:Are you in AZ ... It's a great place to see a lot of different FSJ's and meet Jerry. (Jerry will be a source of those hard to find parts). ;)
I am not in Arizona... but I am definitely interested in "meeting" Jerry to talk about some hard to find parts.

How can I connect with him?
1971 J4600 with Dauntless 350

Topic author
GrandW
Posts: 224
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2018 6:19 pm

Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

Candymancan - that steering wheel wrap looks brilliant. Had shied away from that route as hadn't liked what I'd seen, but that looks really nice. Thanks for the reference.

In terms of recoloring the leather, if anyone else goes that route, just get the primary colors and mix. Think thats easier and less expensive than the color kit.

The dash pad, I'll have to look more into. Right now with the engine out, I don't have anywhere to put a windshield, but we'll see... Good to know there are alternative options.
candymancan wrote:Just get a new wheel cover and stitch it on much easier then sanding removing the steering wheel and dying leather which will leach the dye no matter what you do . They sell matching colors, my 90 the cover was torn on the top from someone who drives with 1 hand on top.

Bought a new cordovan wheel skin from wheelskins.com and cut the old one off and stitched the new one one. Did the same for my moms 4.0 and my 5.9. Also got one for a friends car too..

Theyre like 35$



https://m.imgur.com/a/eUBfX


as for the dash pad ive removed one this year on a 89 GW... Its fairly flat not warped like mine. I just havent put it on yet. Put it on storage with mineral oil on it. To remove it you need to to pull the a.c controls. radio. the glove box. The instrument cluster.. Then prepair to bend your hands in awkward positions using i believe 7 8 10mm sockets... Yea all the nuts are various sizes.. I was cursing like a sailor.

The windshield i was told you have to remove as well so i did and like said all those 13mm bolts are under the windshield gasket. But due to the dash pad vinyl being hard over the years the pad wasnt even being held on by the bolts as the bolt tore right through the pad material lol.. So when i remove mine in my 90 i am going to take a razor blade and cut the dash padd off from under the gasket.. Just cut it off so you have an inch or so of the dash pad UNDER the gasket.. This way when you put a new dash pad on you can just tilt it up and slide it under the windhshield gasket and the gasket will hold it down.. like it was anyway.

Am i making sense here ? There really isnt a need to remove the windhshield if you do it like this.. Just cut under the gasket not along the gasket.

Buttr if youre one of those puritan anal people go ahead and remove the entire windhshield.. Im 99.9% certsin my way will work.. I mean once its bolted down and the windshiekd gasket is laying on top of it.. where exactly is it going to go ?
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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

letank wrote: Impressive detailled work. While I was crawling under the steering wheel, the stench of the sweaty wheel cover detracted me from the ongoing wiring fix... removed the slipped cover, and use paint thinner to clear the black stains, a quick dab of leather conditioner that has been laying around for the last 20 years in the garage and put on another JY slipped-on type ...

As said too much work for the windshield removal unless it is showing signs of leaks... if you have the windshield removed make sure that the correct sealant is used, not silicone, but proper windshield / Glass sealant is used otherwise the acid silicone will make the metal rust and ruins your A pillar...

Okay, you are both selling me on the cover!

The windshield, eventually probably needs to be removed to grind out a small spot of rust before repainting.... but not in a hurry to remove it.

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

Progress continues, sprayed my first panel and super happy with the learning experience. It takes a massive amount of prep, and I'll still likely have it professionally done, but super pleased for the 1st effort.

Hard to see the color, it's a brown in a nod to the original color, but is pearlescent to give it a modern kick. Ends up being a chameleon paint job as it's dark in the shade but absolutely comes alive in the sun.

Left- sanding primer
Right - primed, not sanded
Bottom - painted in booth
pixlr_20181022131145177.jpeg
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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

Fairly pleased. If you were to bend down and inspect it from 12 inches away it would be imperfect, but from standing height it looks good.

Still need to tweak one of them which will be a pain, but restoration can be that way.
ImageImage

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
Posts: 224
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

candymancan wrote: as for the dash pad ive removed one this year on a 89 GW... Its fairly flat not warped like mine. I just havent put it on yet. Put it on storage with mineral oil on it. To remove it you need to to pull the a.c controls. radio. the glove box. The instrument cluster.. Then prepair to bend your hands in awkward positions using i believe 7 8 10mm sockets... Yea all the nuts are various sizes.. I was cursing like a sailor.
Okay, think I'm where you are in terms of getting ready to curse. I've removed most the instrument panels per the TSM. My question is, am I supposed to drill out these rivets (bottom pic, it was under the ashtray), or does that who connecting thing come with the dash pad?Image

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1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

Topic author
GrandW
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Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by GrandW »

Okay, the dash is out! Some helpful info:

http://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3319
https://www.autozone.com/repairguides/J ... 52800aa125

Also, for the next person. After the windshield is removed and you've removed your gauge clusters and the bottom of the dash (at least on the '87 removing the glove box and ashtray wasn't useful), this is how I did it. Not sure it's "right", but if it helps....
On the driver side, there's two bolts seen here. Both these need to be removed.

On the passenger there's a corresponding bolt, remove this.

Below the steering wheel, remove the two nuts on either side.

Now you need to remove the connecting bolts holding the stuff up. There's two on left, then one each going to the fire wall. Remove those.

This should allow you to largely remove the dash.... but vents and such will still be held to the bottom of the dash. Remove the nuts at each end of the vent, then remove the 'things' holding the vent to the back of the glove box.

It's a massive pain, just hoping I can get it all back in. Hope that helps someone else too!
ImageImageImageImageImage
1987 Jeep Grand Wagoneer

letank
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:16 pm
Location: SF bay area

Re: 1987 Grand Wagoneer Restoration

Post by letank »

thank you for posting your progess, very nice paint job on the hub, what is the color code? it is on the vin plate, looks like 4B, or mocha brown metallic

http://www.automotivetouchup.com/touch- ... ll-models/
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)
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