axle re-gear ?

[surfwagoneer]

So as far as my long term build plans go I plan on replacing my 360 with a mildly built 4bt. I have been reading up a lot on 4btswaps.com and learning as much as possible. As far as I can see right now I think my best plan would be to run a nv4500 with my current np229 (if possible?) or maybe a 205. And yes I do plan on moving my gas tank to the rear spare location. So were my question comes into play is I'm coming real close to having to re-gear my axles. As far as I can tell I have stock 2.73 gearing currently w/ stock tires. I will be running 35"x 12.5 soon. My plan was to run 3.73's or 4.10's with the 360 but it looks like the ideal rpm for a 4bt is 1900 (if I am correct, im no guru on this.) With the nv4500 and the 229, or 205, that would put me at about 3.54's (1912 rpm at 75 mph.) And let this be said that my usage is as a daily driver and will see the highway for a mod amount of usage. Mpg will be the ultimate goal along with mild hp increase. The 3.54 gears actually puts me almost at stock ranges with the current 360 and 35's per grim jeeper gear calculator. I know this is always a crazy debate and nobody really seems to agree but was wondering what thoughts were, knowing that this will be a dd and not a weekend rock crawler. Will driving with my current drive train, 35's and 3.54 just suck the life out of driving or not? And to those diesel savy guys- am I correct on my figures and gearing for a 4bt in a waggy, drive train choices? Again with the cummins mpg will be my ultimate goal and I know driving style has a big effect on that so lets say we have ideal driving conditions.

[Stuka]

Are you going to be modding the 4BT at all? In stock form, with those gears and tires, it's going to suck.

I think you need to lower your cruising speed. 75 is high for a lower output engine with large tires.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[surfwagoneer]

Your right, 75 is a bit high and 65 is much more realistic for what I'm going to be doing. Even though many of the NC highways speed limits are 70 mph. I would like to add some power, maybe 175-200hp. Havnt researched enough to tell you how much is realistic at this point. Especially if I go with a VE pump, which is much more likely, which has 105 hp stock vs p-pumped 130hp stock. Most driving is in town but if I can increase my fuel milage and ultimatly run biodiesel then I want to be able to drive this thing anywere! I often make 2 hour drives at 65mph.

[surfwagoneer]

w/ nv4500/229(205)- 1st gear/10mph-1907rpm 3rd gear/35mph-1986 5th gear 65mph-1657 75mph-1912rpm

[Stuka]

4.10's with 35's will put you at 1950rpm at 65mph. 3.73's will put you right between this.

Your other option is to go 33's instead of 35's. Which on a waggy is a lot easier, as it doesnt require cutting the fenders out.

[surfwagoneer]

hmmmmmm.......I see. The trimming is already going to happen and bushwacker flares are going to be installed

[Bostonbob]

my conversion axles

[surfwagoneer]

Bostonbob- what are your conversion axles?

And its looking like I'm back to 3.73's which was one of my choices for running the 360 anyways and I don't have to change carriers. Double plus

[jamesdart]

did you consider doing a full width axle swap? it would probably work well with the extra width of the buschwackers. i just regeared and added an air locker. the whole time i kept telling myself this makes no sense. if you are starting with no lift or tires, i would just go soa, full width, ff rear.

[surfwagoneer]

I am still debating on going full width axles if the bank can handle it. I would be happy with 3/4 tons. As far as the lift goes I already have a 4" spring lift on it with extended shackles up front and 1" zero rate spring in the rear and maybe 1" body lift when the 4bt goes in so there will be no SOA on this rig in the future.....maybe the next one! Any clue what I could find a dana 60 rear w/drum brakes out of that only needed maybe spring perches changed?

[rocklaurence]

IMO, 1900 RPM is the torque range of a gas motor. A diesel makes max torque around 1200-1400 and that is where you want to keep it for fuel mileage.

[Bostonbob]

9 posts down on this diesel page [ all the info ]

[surfwagoneer]

link didnt show up

[Stuka]

I am still debating on going full width axles if the bank can handle it. I would be happy with 3/4 tons. As far as the lift goes I already have a 4" spring lift on it with extended shackles up front and 1" zero rate spring in the rear and maybe 1" body lift when the 4bt goes in so there will be no SOA on this rig in the future.....maybe the next one! Any clue what I could find a dana 60 rear w/drum brakes out of that only needed maybe spring perches changed?

You are not going to fit 35's with only that amount of lift and flares. 33's sure, but I think 35's would be a very tight fit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[surfwagoneer]

I am still debating on going full width axles if the bank can handle it. I would be happy with 3/4 tons. As far as the lift goes I already have a 4" spring lift on it with extended shackles up front and 1" zero rate spring in the rear and maybe 1" body lift when the 4bt goes in so there will be no SOA on this rig in the future.....maybe the next one! Any clue what I could find a dana 60 rear w/drum brakes out of that only needed maybe spring perches changed?

You are not going to fit 35's with only that amount of lift and flares. 33's sure, but I think 35's would be a very tight fit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

why is that? I've seen plenty of wagons w/ 6" of lift with trimming and bushwackers installed and fit 35's just fine. I know I went about it a little a** backwards but I already have 5" of lift and will be trimming at least 2" off the back alone. If they are tight with the 5" then I can easily add 1" body lift to put a full 6" of total lift on. I'll also be putting on rims that are 15x10" with 3.5" backspacing (unless I get lucky and find a killer deal on some full width axles!) And I guess if I'm wrong I'll be saying " DOHHHHH Stuka told me so!"

[Stuka]

Just going off my own experience. I had a 6" lift on my NT Cherokee, 1.25" of trimming, and 33's cleared by about a 1/4". And that was with 15x8 wheels. 10" wheels make the rubbing worse, as will full width axles. Because then the tires are under the fender opening instead of inside it.

It may work fine for you, just sharing my experience.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[surfwagoneer]

Thanks! I always appreciate the input before I go and do something stupid. I'm kinda committed to this one though so I'll let you guys know how everything fits. Actually gonna pick up a pair of 35's tonight for $60 so I'll have a better idea. and I still need to get my hands on the flares and get cutting!

[surfwagoneer]

dana 60hd.... full floater 4:10 - $250

http://images.craigslist.org/00505_aqHb ... 00x450.jpg
http://images.craigslist.org/00707_2E5l ... 00x450.jpg
http://images.craigslist.org/00D0D_ixju ... 00x450.jpg

late 70's ford I believe .... huge axle tubes!! complete and will spin .... don't know ratio.. but I can check for a serious buyer... it may have a tag. very nice piece and hard to get in this area....I bought 2 of these when I converted my jeep to 1 ton's ...... please email and I will respond promptly .... to much spam for a number. jeep ford Chevy Dana fullwidth

Not sure if these pics are going to show up but what do you guys think about this. Been on sale for a while so I could prob. get the guy to come down a bit.

Just move the spring perches? what else would I have to modify?

[surfwagoneer]

also just found this

3.73 Rear Axle Gears - $75
http://images.craigslist.org/3E33G23If5 ... 6217fb.jpg
http://images.craigslist.org/3Ee3G13F65 ... 5b131d.jpg
http://images.craigslist.org/3r63I63q55 ... ba1d7f.jpg
http://images.craigslist.org/3E53F63Lc5 ... 9d1dbe.jpg

It is a Corporate 14 Bolt Rear Axle, Full Float, Locked, 3.73 gears, 30 spline pinion yoke with straps. It is factory locked housing and gears are good to go into anything that will fit. It is out of a 95 GMC K2500. It comes with drums, brake pads and other misc parts if you want them.

[AwesomeJ10]

I would recommend getting a plain old 14 bolt if you are looking to swap axles. Cheap and MUCH easier to setup the gears than a Dana axle. You have to get the crush sleeve eliminator kit in order to make it easier though. 70 bucks.

but most 14 bolts will have 4:10's anyway