87 Grand Wagoneer

[freehold]

A few weeks ago I had to put my daily driver (MDX) into the shop to get some body work done. It was a relatively simple job--just repairing a deep scratch on a rear door--but apparently these days such a fix means the body shop has your car for 15 days.

That meant my GW had to become my daily ride--which wasn't asking a ton of it, but certainly a lot given I've only put about 400 miles on it since we acquired it last fall.

The good news is that it rose to the occasion. Our youngest daughter was instantly popular in the preschool drop-off line. "Is Daddy driving his antique car today?" the preschool director asked.

"It's a JEEP!" my daughter corrected her from the back seat.

A dozen days into the daily effort, though, I had a thermostat issue. The overheating popped the hose that runs from the heater core to the rear of the engine block. I spent the morning replacing that hose, the thermostat, and the upper radiator hose. I continue to mean to replace all the others, but just haven't gotten time yet. The only negative is that there were a couple of spots of antifreeze pooled on top of the engine somewhere--could see or reach it to wipe it up--so she stinks a little of baked coolant right now.

But onward we went, and after the simple repairs, the temp gauge stayed dialed right where it should be. (Which brings about another gift of the experience--the temp gauge works!) And since gas in North Carolina has reverted back to almost early 2000s prices, I probably ought to just go fill it up right now.

It was great fun driving the Wagoneer to work each day. Lots of looks and comments--these things get a lot more attention than I ever thought they did. I don't miss parallel parking it, though.

[sirrus]

Daily driving GW is so fun and rewarding, especially after you’ve fixed something in it! I’ve been driving mine almost exclusively for last 4 weeks, before I disassembled all doors as you said, looks and thumbs up everywhere and I can’t wipe that smile off my face when I’m behind the wheel of waggy

Funny thing that I’ve noticed is that for me it is way easier to park waggy compared to 2017 mustang, even though latter has rear view camera. Bigger windows and narrow pillars help I guess


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[freehold]

Funny thing that I’ve noticed is that for me it is way easier to park waggy compared to 2017 mustang, even though latter has rear view camera. Bigger windows and narrow pillars help I guess

Oh, I totally agree--there's so much visibility in a Wagoneer compared to modern cars. I haven't driven a '17 Mustang, but one time got stuck with a Camaro (airport rental) and felt like I was driving a little cave with a punchy engine. My MDX has virtually zero visibility out the back, but then again it has lots of lights and cameras and beepy things to let me know if I'm about to hit something.

[freehold]

Earlier this week, our family of five had more or less had enough with being cooped up in the house. We all needed to get out. North Carolina is under a stay-at-home order, which we have tried to abide as best we can, but we needed new scenery and fresh air.

Which, in part, is why we own a Grand Wagoneer in the first place.

So after supper one evening we piled in. We live in an interesting place in North Carolina--to the south are the crowded bedroom communities of the Charlotte metro area. To the north: open, rural foothills that run up to our old mountains. We made a wide northern circuit using only two-lane country roads, passing dairy farms, fields full of bright canola, and folks sitting on their front porches. The radio faded in and out and supplied the right kinds of songs for driving with nowhere in mind to go. We watched a glorious sunset. We wound up at the country church where my stepmom is buried. We got home past dark.

One thing I noticed: with the chatter of our family inside, I thought far less about every little spit and sputter our trusty Wagoneer might make along the way. By the end of our hour-plus tour, it was warm and humming along as smooth as silk.

I cannot wait to throw the camping gear in the back and head to a state park when they open back up.

[dodgerammit]

Earlier this week, our family of five had more or less had enough with being cooped up in the house. We all needed to get out. North Carolina is under a stay-at-home order, which we have tried to abide as best we can, but we needed new scenery and fresh air.

Which, in part, is why we own a Grand Wagoneer in the first place.

So after supper one evening we piled in. We live in an interesting place in North Carolina--to the south are the crowded bedroom communities of the Charlotte metro area. To the north: open, rural foothills that run up to our old mountains. We made a wide northern circuit using only two-lane country roads, passing dairy farms, fields full of bright canola, and folks sitting on their front porches. The radio faded in and out and supplied the right kinds of songs for driving with nowhere in mind to go. We watched a glorious sunset. We wound up at the country church where my stepmom is buried. We got home past dark.

One thing I noticed: with the chatter of our family inside, I thought far less about every little spit and sputter our trusty Wagoneer might make along the way. By the end of our hour-plus tour, it was warm and humming along as smooth as silk.

I cannot wait to throw the camping gear in the back and head to a state park when they open back up.

This folks. This this is what these things are designed for.

Too many (especially every tom, Dick, and Harry on the FB group) want something that has the power and handles like a modern crossover stuffed into these Wags.

Kudos on you for acknowledging the differences between this and the Acura, and embracing those differences.

I daily a 2000 T/A. Powerful? Yep. Handles the roads exceptionally well? Yep.

Does it float like riding on a cloud or have impeccable visibility?
If I want that, I'll drive the Wag. Something about going back 30 years to simplicity and no hurries.

[freehold]

Known functional gremlins:

- Fuel gauge best functions when the Jeep is still and on level ground. Otherwise the needle bobs up and down with the car
- Oil pressure gauge hits 80psi when accelerating, sits about 40psi when idling at a stop. Need to see if it's accurate or not
- Battery bracket is missing and currently the battery is held in place by a heavy bungee strap
- Four wheel drive doesn't seem to be working. I hear the vacuum swoosh when I slide the switch, but the lamp on the dash stays dark.
- On a related note, attempted to slide shifter into 4-LO, but it won't budge
- One Marchal fog lamp cracked; neither work when I flick the switch
- Driver rear window does not operate operates seasonally
- Driver rear door lock also not very cooperative
- Tailgate window operational, but only from interior switch, not from rear/exterior lock
- Interior cabin lights only come on when one of the rear doors is opened. Front doors don't activate cabin lights
- Power side view mirrors don't work
- Parking brake functions, but doesn't stay put--just pops back up
- NSS is on the brink of going out went out

Known cosmetic gremlins:

- Driver rear door arm rest seems to be held in place by sheet metal screws (probably explains the two Dr/Rear issues above)
- Haven't checked the well nuts (and not sure how) on the roof rack but not planning to park in the rain til I do
- Woodgrain vinyl isn't in great shape, but paint and body are solid. Paint was redone sometime in the last 10 years.
- Rear wing needs woodgrain vinyl badly
- Front seats cracked, currently under some cheap seat covers. Rear bench seats in good/original condition
- Carpet/mats original and in okay condition but could use cleaning/replacement

So I'm updating my list slightly.

A few weeks ago, I had the kids in the car when my son decided to attempt to roll down the driver's side rear window. I had known the window not to work, but to my surprise, down it went. And... back up it went. From his switch, from mine. I have no idea if something bumped it back into operation, or if it's just a warm weather window, or what. But it works. Admittedly, the only window I take all the way down is the driver's side--too paranoid to lose any right now.

On the flip side, I now need to add the neutral safety switch to the list of gremlins. Earlier this summer, there were a handful of times when I'd go to crank the Wagoneer and I'd get no response. Sometimes a jiggle of the gear selector, nudging it all the way up into park, would let me engage the starter, and other times, I could start it in neutral. This past weekend, though, I appear to have run out of grace.

I've got a couple of good threads to read here and on IFSJA to help me out (doesn't seem to be too difficult of a fix, mostly just trying to find the thing), and Advance Auto seems to have a replacement NSS, albeit at a store 30 miles away. (That seems a better solution than TGW, given their slow shipping record.) Beyond the wisdom and counsel already on this site, any other thoughts?

[FLeetFox]

Might just want to to change the trans fluid at the same time while your down there. Drop pan, new filter and gasket plus replacing that switch. I bet if you look under there it's probably weeping or leaking anyways. It's not voodoo, you can do this easily just take your time and don't over tighten the pan bolts. the switch itself is really a piece of cake. On the driver's side, above the pan, behind the shifter linkage. Make sure when you get the switch it comes with the gasket/ o-ring.

Fleet Fox

[freehold]

Might just want to to change the trans fluid at the same time while your down there. Drop pan, new filter and gasket plus replacing that switch. I bet if you look under there it's probably weeping or leaking anyways. It's not voodoo, you can do this easily just take your time and don't over tighten the pan bolts. the switch itself is really a piece of cake. On the driver's side, above the pan, behind the shifter linkage. Make sure when you get the switch it comes with the gasket/ o-ring.

This turned out to be great advice. Like any good project, though, this one wasn't without its highs and lows.

First--weirdly--I got the Jeep started without having to jump the starter solenoid. It had been temperamental before, so I was happy it was in a good mood.

I picked up this switch from BWD, plus several quarts of Dex III, a filter and gasket kit, and a quart of Lucas stop-slip, then went down to my father-in-law's garage, where we could pull the GW over a pit. The switch was easy enough to find, and we decided to go ahead and drop the pan and change the transmission fluid/filter. That went easily enough, minus the little trans fluid bath you take dropping the pan on these things.

Everything was buttoned back up, and the fluid was topped off. I drove it a few miles, then brought it back to the garage to take another measure--all good. Except we noticed when I backed out of the garage, the reverse lights didn't function.

We spent an hour or so testing things, and long story short, we ended up pulling the new NSS out and putting the old one back in. (This, for the record, evacuated about a quart of brand-new transmission fluid.) The issue seemed to be that the new switch wasn't an exact replica of the old one; the plug didn't fit snuggly enough on the new NSS to engage the reverse lights when backing unless you barely screwed it into the transmission. That seemed like a bad idea. So back to the old switch--and everything ended up working fine. We topped off the transmission--again--and turned our attention to another few items on the list.

We spent the last couple hours working through the inoperable fog lights. Using an ohm meter, we worked our way from the light to the switch under the dash, which seemed to be an issue. We took the switch out and worked and worked on it, but we couldn't get it to read on the meter. Putting the dash back together was a bear. I see now why people just decide to drill new holes and go with that. Lining everything back up is awful. Eventually we realized we were going to have to tear back into it to put in a new switch anyway, so we got it fastened into place and came home.

I can't imagine there's an easy replica of the fog light switch--but would welcome any advice about what fits that space.

So: after an eight hour day in the garage, the Jeep is starting reliably, the reverse lights work, the transmission is well-lubricated, and the dash is missing a switch. The one part we'd hoped to replace didn't get done. But it runs, and we live to wrench another day.

[sirrus]

BJs sell the exact fog switch for later model years https://www.bjsoffroad.com/Fog-Lamp-Swi ... _2186.html

Little pricey at $38, button is a direct replacement.


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[freehold]

BJs sell the exact fog switch for later model years https://www.bjsoffroad.com/Fog-Lamp-Swi ... _2186.html

Little pricey at $38, button is a direct replacement.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks so much for the quick referral--I ordered the replacement, and yesterday it arrived in the mail. I popped it in today, cleaned up the contacts on the relay switch mounted under the hood, and rather quickly had working fog lamps for the first time since we bought the Jeep last year. It was great to get them working again, and new switch looks great.

[dodgerammit]

So I'm updating my list slightly.

A few weeks ago, I had the kids in the car when my son decided to attempt to roll down the driver's side rear window. I had known the window not to work, but to my surprise, down it went. And... back up it went. From his switch, from mine. I have no idea if something bumped it back into operation, or if it's just a warm weather window, or what. But it works. Admittedly, the only window I take all the way down is the driver's side--too paranoid to lose any right now.

Clean the master switch internals. Good video on youtube about it.

[sirrus]

Those switches are usually the main reason why windows don't or barely work. Same case with power seats and mirrors - those didn't work at all when I bought my Jeep, but all it took to get them, working is careful disassembly of switches, cleaning and putting it back with some dielectric grease. Works fine ever since

[candymancan]

Earlier this week, our family of five had more or less had enough with being cooped up in the house. We all needed to get out. North Carolina is under a stay-at-home order, which we have tried to abide as best we can, but we needed new scenery and fresh air.

Which, in part, is why we own a Grand Wagoneer in the first place.

So after supper one evening we piled in. We live in an interesting place in North Carolina--to the south are the crowded bedroom communities of the Charlotte metro area. To the north: open, rural foothills that run up to our old mountains. We made a wide northern circuit using only two-lane country roads, passing dairy farms, fields full of bright canola, and folks sitting on their front porches. The radio faded in and out and supplied the right kinds of songs for driving with nowhere in mind to go. We watched a glorious sunset. We wound up at the country church where my stepmom is buried. We got home past dark.

One thing I noticed: with the chatter of our family inside, I thought far less about every little spit and sputter our trusty Wagoneer might make along the way. By the end of our hour-plus tour, it was warm and humming along as smooth as silk.

I cannot wait to throw the camping gear in the back and head to a state park when they open back up.

This folks. This this is what these things are designed for.

Too many (especially every tom, Dick, and Harry on the FB group) want something that has the power and handles like a modern crossover stuffed into these Wags.

Kudos on you for acknowledging the differences between this and the Acura, and embracing those differences.

I daily a 2000 T/A. Powerful? Yep. Handles the roads exceptionally well? Yep.

Does it float like riding on a cloud or have impeccable visibility?
If I want that, I'll drive the Wag. Something about going back 30 years to simplicity and no hurries.

Mine drove like it was floating on a cloud when the leaf springs were inverted upside down from being severly worn out haha.. when i first got it. Now with the mud terrains and new springs and add a leaf it drives rough but i dont care. I drive mine daily, in fact my 5.9 ZJ is just to get to work and back and after that i drive my wagoneer everywhere. I have put 30k miles on it in the last 4 1/2 years now. I know thats under 10k a year but thats because i still drive the 5.9 ZJ.

Constant repairs though have caused me to neglect the ZJ, it needs alot of work

I will note though my 98 5.9 ZJ is nearing 23 years old, it rides so much smoother, still has nearly as much cargo room, (80 cubic feet i believe the most out of all the grand cherokee's even current ones.) and with the 5.9 Liter magnum V8 i can zip around people easily if i wanted. Gas mileage and range is double that of the wagoneer as well. LOL. I wont drive any of the newer Jeeps from 99+ though.

I get no thumbs up or Jeep waves or anything in the 5.9 ZJ though, even 99% Jeep people dont know what they are. They are much rarer then a wagoneer. The Wagoneer gets thumbs up and wow from all ages, little kids love the wood and how different it looks, and older people tell me stories of how they used to have one in the family.

Its actually just like Jeeps new Wagoneer promotion video.


As for bad switchs working in different temps, these switchs use male pins and female openeings to connect power, over time or from cleaning them they can loose their grip and cause them to work intermitantly. I cleaned my master switch and it made it work due to the pin not being clamped down hard enough anymore.

[freehold]

Something odd happened this weekend.

Drove my Wagoneer around town Sunday morning--no issues, nothing to note. It was a crisp fall morning here in N.C., and I turned on the heat for the first time since last spring. Brought it home, parked it for about five hours, then loaded up my family and drove fifteen minutes to my Dad's house for supper.

Two hours later, I walked outside and happened to notice the Jeep had a puddle under it. Uh oh. Laid down in the driveway and felt it--antifreeze, and there was a slow but steady drip from the rear of the engine compartment, near the firewall. In fact, I first noticed it on the cross member right near the transmission pan. But I couldn't see from above or below where it was leaking.

It was getting dark, but I cranked it up, observed there wasn't an imminent hose failure, loaded everyone up, and made it home without incident. Nothing seemed out of the ordinary--the motor ran strong, the temperature on the dash stayed in perfectly normal range. Even more interesting, when I parked it at my house, it wasn't dripping. I came out half an hour later, no drip. No drip when I went to bed, no drip when I woke up.

When I got home from work this evening, I started it up, brought it to operating temperature, turned the heat on, turned the heat off, etc. No drip. Turned the engine off and let it sit--no drip. The closest I got to anything exciting was seeing the steam from where the drip from last night had made it on top of the exhaust pipe.

My gut tells me there's something amiss with the heater core. I spent a good amount of time searching this forum and found a few threads on the topic concerning a GW of my vintage. Given that I have A/C, I'm not excited about the possibility of replacing it, and when viewed from the bottom, it looks like someone has already been in the box, and that the box was brittle (as noted in several other threads) because there seems to be some fiberglass tape or something patching it.

But it's just dang weird, almost like the thing decided to belch out a little coolant and be done with it. So I've put a few jugs of antifreeze in the back so I have an ample supply should things suddenly go south while I have it out, and now I'm going to be a bit more paranoid about glancing under it when I park it somewhere.

[freehold]

Also, while I was poking around this evening, I realized I have a disconnected wire (see arrow). I think it goes to the part that I've circled. Is this the suppressor? Is this the reason my FM radio fades in and out sometimes?

[tgreese]

Yes, it's a capacitor (antiquated term: condensor). No effect on fading. Only purpose is to filter ignition noise from the radio signal. If you hear a whine in the radio that's in time with the engine speed, replacing this part may help.

Fading in and out is a reception issue. Possible the antenna, or the radio is old and its frequency alignment may have drifted. Alignment by a radio shop may help, maybe not. FM does not have a long range, and you may be experiencing the limits of car radio reception and its tiny antenna. FM radio signal is only reliable in urban areas, within say 30-50 miles of the tower, in my experience. AM propagates much better, but is noisy and lacks the dynamic range of FM. If you really want broadcast music, suggest you buy a satellite receiver and a subscription.

I'm less than 10 miles from downtown Boston, and I get lots of FM stations - even the college stations. In the Los Angeles area, FM reception is pretty good because the towers are on Mt. Wilson and the signal blankets the LA/valley/OC basin. Other places with less relief will have worse coverage.

[freehold]

Yes, it's a capacitor (antiquated term: condensor). No effect on fading. Only purpose is to filter ignition noise from the radio signal. If you hear a whine in the radio that's in time with the engine speed, replacing this part may help.

That's what I was thinking--that if it were an issue, I'd hear a whine or whistling sound, which I don't. To which I say, don't mess with it. My other cars have no issues with FM signals (I'm in the Charlotte suburban metro area), but the stock radio in my GW clearly doesn't cut the same mustard. I've debated replacing the radio in the dash, especially since the digital display often flickers in and out (unless the headlights are on, which... well anyway) but I keep landing on the fence of keeping it because a) it's the original!, b) this car isn't for jamming in, and c) it adds to the patina of driving around in a 1987 time machine.

I'm less than 10 miles from downtown Boston, and I get lots of FM stations - even the college stations. In the Los Angeles area, FM reception is pretty good because the towers are on Mt. Wilson and the signal blankets the LA/valley/OC basin. Other places with less relief will have worse coverage.

You getting ready to mount snow tires?

In a former life, I traveled often for my job, and though I originally hail from the Jersey shore, and I was raised in a family that preferred the USSR over New England in all things athletically oriented, I have to say I truly enjoyed traveling in and around Boston. I've made dozens of trips there, and I always enjoyed my time in Boston. I also made my way to Fenway several times, and I found it to be among the best historical ballparks I've ever visited. I'd put it up there with old Yankee stadium, Wrigley, and Dodger Stadium.

[tgreese]

Mmm. You could keep the original radio and put a satellite receiver under the dash?

Continuing with the off-topic content ...

Fenway Park is fun. I've even gone there on dates a few times - so much fun with the right person. Just about everywhere in the park is really close to the field. Long ago, I had a friend and colleague at work (RIP) with season tickets. She would resell tickets to many of the games to me and others. These were behind home plate, to the right at the edge of the foul screen. Really great. One caveat - Fenway can be cold! I went a few times in April where I was all wrapped up and still felt cold.

Chavez Ravine is a historic park? Funny. I went there with my parents and grandparents soon after it was opn, say '61-62ish? My folks moved to Orange County and became Angels fans. Went to games at the Big A with my Mom; another great memory. Usually lots of seats available there in the summer, but it can be hot (!) in the full sun.

[freehold]

Chavez Ravine is a historic park?

It is now! It's the third oldest park still in operation. As someone who laughs every time I hear that the Carolina Panthers' stadium is among the oldest in the NFL (it opened in 1996), I can relate to how quickly these venues reach historic status.

Back to the conversation at hand--I think, if anything, I would add an auxiliary or blutooth input and use my mobile. My Sirius/XM subscription can be played on my phone, and that saves adding another radio to the lineup--and I could also use Spotify/Pandora/etc.

But I guess I keep siding on the appeal of tin-can-on-a-string sounding speakers and simplicity of AM/FM/Cassette original radio. For now, at least.

[letank]

back to your coolant leak , albeit I enjoyed the off topic, on across the state trips, the radio is indeed useless, the entertainment is watching the landscape and the other drivers' behavior!

at some point you will smell the sweet coolant thru the vents... use the defrost and fan on medium speed and wipe the inside windshield to check for greasy residue. The AC is a bit of a pain to wedge out, but a small rachet wrench might do the trick to reach the inside nuts to loosen the heater box. No a bad job, stretch before proceeding! and as usual disconnect the battery!

In desperation you can buy one of these coolant seal all compound, yes you will loose cooling capacity, the temp gauge will read higher, but after a few driving cycles you can drain some of the coolant and refill (may be 1/2 gallon) . I had to use this type of sealant when the block heater started to leak, I tried to extract the block heater, but it was not budging, regardless of the size of the hammer used.... and it has been over 15 years and many coolant flush and water pump replacements, no leaks!

before I forget, the heater hose in the back of the intake manifold has is hooked up to a real thin metal fitting where the vacuum switch connect, it may ooze from that location... I have a pict to be added

this one



and after removal



of course the part is NLA, so these will do



and an extension because the trans dipstick tube is in the way



and the final result