Morons

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Hspencer
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Morons

Post by Hspencer » Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:05 am

So a few months ago I took my 08 JKU to the shop to be overhauled. The pinion seal was leaking and the bearing had failed. After pulling it apart there were issues with the carrier and in the end it was cheaper to just pickup a used axle with 30,000 miles. Since they already had it and it was still on the lift I just had the do the swap. I picked it up, drive it home and parked it. A few weeks ago I pulled my sons 88 wagoneer in the garage to install Holley hyperspark and apply the wood grain and trim. He’s been driving the JKU for a few weeks, this morning I get a call from him and the left rear wheel came off on his way to school. Fortunately he was only going a few MPH as he was pulling out of a side street. I got there to find that all five wheel studs had broken off, I checked the lug nuts on the right rear and 3 of 5 could be turned by hand, I suspect the other two were only tight because they were oriented on top and the weight of the Jeep keeping them tight.

I know we all make mistakes but not tightening lug nuts and properly torquing them is just unacceptable. Since it took a while to happen (maybe 200 miles) my theory is that the tech was using a cordless impact with a low battery. I’ve had issues removing lug nuts and other bolts with mine with a low battery, swap in a freshly charged battery and they came right off. While I always use the cordless impact to install lug nuts I always go back and torque by hand.

The shop owner wasn’t there and the guy that did the work came out and said he would “try to figure out what happened”, I told him there wasn’t any question what happened, I’m sure he’ll try to come up with something to cover his butt.

So now the shop is on the hook for wheel studs, new wheel as the holes are wallowed out, repair the fender flare and bumper that were damaged when the wheel came off. It’s unfortunate that my son was driving it, he just turned 16 in November and just doesn’t have the experience feel when something isn’t right and question if there could be a problem, I’m sure the radio has been blasting so he Surely wouldn’t have heard anything odd.

Moral of the story, always check behind anyone that touches my vehicles!


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1988 GW
1984 Wagoneer(SJ)
2008 JK

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Hspencer
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Re: Morons

Post by Hspencer » Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:07 am

Hspencer wrote:So a few months ago I took my 08 JKU to the shop to be overhauled. The pinion seal was leaking and the bearing had failed. After pulling it apart there were issues with the carrier and in the end it was cheaper to just pickup a used axle with 30,000 miles. Since they already had it and it was still on the lift I just had the do the swap. I picked it up, drive it home and parked it. A few weeks ago I pulled my sons 88 wagoneer in the garage to install Holley hyperspark and apply the wood grain and trim. He’s been driving the JKU for a few weeks, this morning I get a call from him and the left rear wheel came off on his way to school. Fortunately he was only going a few MPH as he was pulling out of a side street. I got there to find that all five wheel studs had broken off, I checked the lug nuts on the right rear and 3 of 5 could be turned by hand, I suspect the other two were only tight because they were oriented on top and the weight of the Jeep keeping them tight.

I know we all make mistakes but not tightening lug nuts and properly torquing them is just unacceptable. Since it took a while to happen (maybe 200 miles) my theory is that the tech was using a cordless impact with a low battery. I’ve had issues removing lug nuts and other bolts with mine with a low battery, swap in a freshly charged battery and they came right off. While I always use the cordless impact to install lug nuts I always go back and torque by hand.

The shop owner wasn’t there and the guy that did the work came out and said he would “try to figure out what happened”, I told him there wasn’t any question what happened, I’m sure he’ll try to come up with something to cover his butt.

So now the shop is on the hook for wheel studs, new wheel as the holes are wallowed out, repair the fender flare and bumper that were damaged when the wheel came off. It’s unfortunate that my son was driving it, he just turned 16 in November and just doesn’t have the experience feel when something isn’t right and question if there could be a problem, I’m sure the radio has been blasting so he Surely wouldn’t have heard anything odd.

Moral of the story, always check behind anyone that touches my vehicles!


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1988 GW
1984 Wagoneer(SJ)
2008 JK


SJTD
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Re: Morons

Post by SJTD » Thu Dec 19, 2019 12:50 pm

I don't think they were undertorqured. Why would they break? Seems to me they were overtorqued with a big impact wrench their yield point.

I hope you're making them replace all twenty.
Sic friatur crustulum

'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

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Re: Morons

Post by Hspencer » Thu Dec 19, 2019 3:06 pm

I think they were under torqued BC the ones on the other side were loose. I think they were tight enough to not notice they were loose. When they started to loosen up more it caused the lugs to wallow out the mounting holes in the wheel. If they broke from being over torqued the wheel would’ve been ok, 2 of them are now oblong and one shows significant wear. Combine loose lug nuts, manual transmission and a 16 year old and I think this is the result.


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SJTD
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Re: Morons

Post by SJTD » Thu Dec 19, 2019 3:30 pm

I don't see them breaking due to being loose. At least not all of them. I figure they would've backed out until they fell out or if maybe three adjacent backed out the rest might then break.

Would be nice to get your hands on the others to see if they're stretched.

Can you get a good close up of the busted ones to see what the fracture pattern looks like?
Sic friatur crustulum

'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

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Re: Morons

Post by Hspencer » Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:18 pm

These are factory wheels and are hub centric, you can see where the wheel has rubbed and wore on the axle hub. It seems more logical that the lug nuts backed out a bit allowing the wheel to move on the hub under acceleration/deceleration add to that an inexperienced driver dumping the clutch at higher than normal rpms to avoid stalling. Plus the fact that the lug nuts on the other side of the same axle are loose. I suppose if they were grossly over tightened and stretched they could’ve loosened up causing this to happen. Either way, everything I’ve read indicates over torqued or loose lug nuts have similar results.


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2008 JK

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Re: Morons

Post by Stuka » Fri Dec 20, 2019 8:58 am

This looks like loose lug nuts too me. The hub centric wheel can really mask the issue.

Glad your son was ok, that’s a big even for a 16 year old.
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Lifted and stuff
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

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Hspencer
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Re: Morons

Post by Hspencer » Fri Dec 20, 2019 9:25 am

Thanks, me too. Just glad it happened at a low speed, could’ve been really bad at hwy speeds.


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Re: Morons

Post by candymancan » Sat Jan 18, 2020 11:49 am

Recently i had to go to my moms work because she said her jeep was making poping noises the 98 4.0 zj. I went there and jacked the front end up and wiggled the tires and the drivers side wheel was wiggling like mad. All 5 lugs were hand toght. The last time i touched that wheel was over a year ago. But she did get an insoection a month ago and i garuntee you 100% the inspector didnt torque the lugs properly. I really hate when they remove the wheels to look at the brakes.

Shes lucky it didnt pop off on the interstate going to work because she drives on the interstate with speeds up to 65-70 mph
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP/650 crank 40k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 195k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 274k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 132k

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Re: Morons

Post by Hspencer » Sat Jan 18, 2020 3:40 pm

I know, it’s ridiculous that most shops won’t take a few minutes to properly torque lugs. The shop tried the blame game telling me that since I supplied the axle for the swap they wouldn’t guarantee it. Fortunately the same shop had just done gear swap on my 88 GW so I checked the lug torque on it, the range was 60-115 ftlbs. I didn’t get any pushback after telling them that.


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Re: Morons

Post by candymancan » Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:44 pm

Thats why when i get work (rarely ever) done i sit there and watch they hate that.. when i get inspections i tell them to leave the wheel on they can use a mirror to look at the brake pads if they want.

And if they insist on taking it off i make then torwue the wheels by hand with a torque wrench.

One time my mom and I got 8 brand new all terrain tires at the same time on our ZJs. They were a cooper off brand i forgot the name but they were good tires made by cooper. Anyway, in 1 week her rear tire blew... pissed i went back to that shop and denanded a replacement. They looked over the tire and said it was due to being underinflated and put the blame on us. Lol underinflated 1 week after having them installed.. righttttt so i called cooper and they sent me a brand new tire and paid a different shop to install it.

My mom didnt want to wait so she bought a new one. Which is fine. I went to thr junkyard got a spare rim from a ZJ and mounted the tire cooper sent on that so now she has a full sized spare vs the donut Jeep gave the 2-4Wd select trac Jeeps.

Anyway shortly after her tire blee i noticed ALL FOUR yes all 4 tires on my 5.9 zj were deflating. I had to refill them every 3 days. I decided to go to sams club since im a member and they do tire work for free. They check my tires and sure enough all 4 were leaking on the beads


They removed the tires.. cleaned the rims and used a bead sealant which is what the other shop should have done anyway.. snd i havent had issues in 4 years owning these tires.

Which means the shop didnt mount the 8 tires properly thats why hers blew and why 4 of mine were losing air.

Get this.. that same shop liftee my zj up on a lift using the floor boards and punched a hole in my floor on one side. They denied it and i had to fix it myself.. that shop is a liability and needs to be closed
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP/650 crank 40k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 195k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 274k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 132k

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