Power Steering Pump issue on '66 Wagoneer

[AZOutdoors]

My power steering pump on my '66 Wagoneer was working great but leaking pretty bad so I bought a new seal kit. Cleaned it up and replaced the seals and no more leaks. However....I now have a stutter/vibration whenever it is under load. When I first re-assembled it, I lifted the front wheels off the ground and moved the steering lock to lock a number of times (without the engine running) until the bubbles stopped. I then did the same with the engine running. With the wheels off the ground, it runs as smooth as butter. But when I drive it, any time I start to turn the wheel, I get the vibration and noise. Kind of feels like a normal pump does when it is held all the way over to one side. I tried driving slowly for quite a ways going lock to lock to see if there may be air still trapped but no luck. Now the suspicious part. When I replaced all the seals, I did not replace an o-ring called out on the attached drawing. The O-Ring is 10.430-12 (in the schematic, it is shown below the reservoir a bit to the left) and is called the Power Steering Pump By-Pass O-Ring. It is not clear where it goes from the schematic, and when I had the pump apart, I didn't see any other o-rings or seals. I am not familiar enough with the pumps operation to know if the problem could be related to an o-ring I missed. Thoughts?

[Stuka]

When you go full lock, the pressure inside the pump will skyrocket, which then results in fluid going through the pumps bypass. The bypass can be activated anytime the pressure goes too high.

It sounds like fluid is being diverted out the bypass for just regular driving for you. This could be due to the o-ring leaking some, so it won't hold as much pressure. Or it could be the spring was not seated properly, or maybe is bent, or something that is now causing it to no longer hold the same amount of pressure.

[AZOutdoors]

Thanks Stuka. That explanation was very helpful. I will pull it back apart and see if I can find the location of that O-Ring and double check the condition of the spring and piston.
In the meantime, wondering if anyone has found a replacement pump? Not many vendors records cross-reference these old Wagoneers. I attached the schematic of the steering box it has (which also leaks so will be my next project )

[tgreese]

The steering gear is made by Saginaw (GM) and used in many vehicles. There is plenty of support for that. Check for online articles about Saginaw power steering gears.

The power steering pump is an Eaton brand. You could upgrade to the more modern Saginaw pump, but I expect it won't bolt in. You may be able to purchase a new replacement, and add your reservoir, pulley, etc. Summit Racing lists new replacements, but maybe not crossed-over to the Jeep engines. If you look up say a '66 AMC Ambassador 327 at RockAuto, you may find a new replacement.
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.ph ... 80&jsn=353 - there you go.

Your local old-time parts store can get that Cardone listing, and should take it back if it's wrong and you are a good customer. Chat them up on a weekday afternoon when it's slow and see if they'll help you.

[JWestfall]

I have a 71 with the Eaton power steering pump. Don't buy the one from Summit. I did and it was terrible out of the box. I put my old one back on with a couple of new O-rings and it works great and is quiet. It just leaks out of the lid periodically no matter what I do. I replaced the lid gaskets and no matter what I do, I end up with some PS fluid on floor of the garage sometime, but not all the time. I had checked a bunch of AMC forums because it was a common pump on older AMC's, and it was pretty common for them to just leak a little out of the lid. If you actually find a solution, please post it because I will try it. The new model pump from Saginaw doesn't fit the Eaton brackets and the brackets you need aren't cheap.

[AZOutdoors]

Thanks tgreese for that info! Great suggestions and they continue to add to the quantity of beers I owe you some day. JWestfall - thanks for the info.
Funny you mentioned the lid. After I got back from my first test drive after sealing the pump, I had fluid leaking all over the place. Thought I really screwed up the rebuild, but it turned out to be the lid.
The old fluid in the pump was red so I am assuming it was ATF. I used synthetic PS fluid which I assume if ok and not causing my issue.....

[AZOutdoors]

Success! I opened the pump back up and did find an o-ring that I did not replace the first time. It looked more like a bushing in the hole and didn't realize it was completely flat o-ring. In addition, I am not sure I had the cam ring clocked correctly. It works much better now (although I still get a little bit of that vibration under load for the first minute while cold). Hoping that may be a bit of air still trapped in the system. Thanks again to all that weighed in to help.

[Harry Dawg]

Just picked up the full power steering assembly from a 66' parts truck. (pump,gear box, brackets, and steering shaft). Paid $350, which after reading this thread seems like a bit much for worn out components. I didn't realize after market replacements existed for these trucks. At least I have a genuine AMC setup I reckon!

Anyways, they will both need a full rebuild before swapping in. Would you mind posting up links to the rebuild kit?

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[AZOutdoors]

Harry...this is the kit I used for the Power Steering Pump. Sunsong 8401020 Power Steering Pump Seal Kit, 1 Pack. It was about $15 on Amazon. I think it was a pretty good kit with a diagram of the location of the various seals. Even though I claimed success...the vibration under load seems to be slowly getting worse again. I may have to bite the bullet and get a new pump if it keeps getting worse....

[Harry Dawg]

Thanks for the info.
Based on the diagram above, it looks like my snap ring pliers will be getting a work out.

Sorry to hear that you're still experiencing vibration issues. I will keep an eye out as I rebuild for anything that may be useful.

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[AZOutdoors]

Update...still a challenge.
The "groan" and significant vibration I feel when turning the wheel under load continued to get worse so I decided to replace the pump thinking that maybe the bypass spring was bad. Unfortunately, the problem still exits with the new pump. Without the engine running and the wheels in the air, I went lock to lock about 30 times. I then ran the engine and repeated the procedure. I then waited 24 hours and did the same process again. I do see the level in the reservoir go up and down as I go lock to lock but I am not seeing any bubbles. The steering is smooth and quite with the wheels in the air, but as soon as I drop them down and turn the wheel, I get a groan and vibration bad enough to shake the steering wheel pretty hard.
A few things I was going to try. I used Autozone "Pro Shop" power steering fluid. Should I flush the system and try a different fluid?
I am thinking of building a sealed cap with a nipple for the reservoir lid and put it under vacuum as I go lock to lock to see if air is trapped.
Could there be an issue in the steering box causing the problem? It is probably the original steering box. Thanks!

[Yeller]

My guess would be steering box issue. From what you are describing it sounds like an internal leak in the box

[Stuka]

The fluid would not be causing this.

But as Yeller notes, it sounds like an internal leak. Where fluid is going from the pressure side to the return side inside the box.

I believe 66 should have a Saginaw box, which means getting a rebuilt unit should not be too hard.

[Yeller]

If it is a Saginaw it should be the same as any newer wagon or j truck with the exception of the the rag joint spline, those are inexpensive. If you don’t mind adding fitting adapters even as new as 2000 XJ/TJ is the same box, just a faster ratio. I have an XJ box in my 70

[AZOutdoors]

Thanks for all the input. Looks like a new steering box is next on the list. Thanks for the tips on the likely replacements Yeller.

[Yeller]

Your welcome. I’m all for preserving vehicles as they were but also believe if they drive nice they get used more, which to me is the most important.

[tgreese]

The Jeep steering gears use 4 bolts to hold the gear to the bracket. I hear many of the parts-store replacements use the 3-bolt housing and call that an "equivalent" of the stronger 4-bolt housing. The 4-bolt cores are more scarce and you may want to insist on a 4-bolt replacement.

The gear from a 4x4 Blazer or Jimmy or Bravada or S10 is a popular swap to the later vehicles. These newer gears are variable ratio, and the 4x4 gear is a slower ratio than their 2WD counterparts. They are 3-bolt housings though. Word is you can pick these directly from the junkyard and bolt in, since the newer gears are much more durable than your original, and there's no need to refurbish before use.

I'm sure a custom gear builder like ReadHead could build an exact replacement for your gear with a 4-bolt housing and variable ratio, with whatever ultimate ratio you wanted.

[Yeller]

Yes the 3 and 4 bolt boxes are interchangeable. I’m hard on equipment, and have never had an issue with a 3 bolt box.

[AZOutdoors]

You guys nailed the issue as usual. I replaced the steering box and the problem went away so looks like it was an internal leak in the steering box. Saying that I now have a rebuilt steering pump available (without the reservoir and pulley) if anyone needs one for free.

[Stuka]

Glad you got it fixed!